Music By Jason

Music By Jason Forums => The Composers' Workshop => Topic started by: SnakeEyes on August 19, 2005, 05:50:11 PM

Title: Gigastudio 3 latency question
Post by: SnakeEyes on August 19, 2005, 05:50:11 PM

I recently acquired Gigastudio 3 and I have a Kurzweil SP-88 that I am pluging in through the MIDI-OUT to a USB MIDISPORT 4x4 M-AUDIO MIDI IN and that goes to the computer USB port. ( and I am using Cakewalk's Sonar 4 to record the MIDI).

Now, in Gigastudio I put on my samples and play on the keyboard and can listen to them (I am rewiring to Cakewalk Sonar 4). Question is, when I play on the keyboard it takes up to 1 sec to listen to it in Sonar... Is there anything I can do to improve this latency?

I have Windows XP Professional, USB1.0...

Much Appreciated,

Title: Gigastudio 3 latency question
Post by: Melda on August 19, 2005, 06:01:48 PM
I don't really have much of a clue in these matters, but my guess would be that the USB 1.0 might be a problem . . . USB 1.0 is orders of magnitude slower thatn 2.0, so that might be a problem.


Title: *dangles*
Post by: SnakeEyes on August 19, 2005, 06:12:21 PM
*Dangles after hanging himself with newly acquired MIDI cables*

Ok... its not sonar 4. I just recorded a MIDI session with SONAR 4 ( piano pluging to MIDI IN pluging to USB ) and it works perfectly...

Therefore it has to be a Rewire problem on Gigastudio!

Like, the midi information gets to Sonar in a very timely fashion... so then Sonar tells Gigastudio "Play this Ab on Midi channel whatever" then Gigastudio returns the sound to Sonar and it comes out as Audio right?

Is there a way to improve then the way my Gigastudio behaves? Or my computer just sucks? I have a Pentium 4 2.6Mhz with 1Gb of RAM though... what to do what to do ....

TomServo, if you read this! You said that I should painstakingly enter the notes playing them myself for a performance that is more realistic. Would it be ok for me then to just record everything using the keyboard (lets say a 16 channel MIDI piece) and directly to Cakewalk's Sonar 4, then after I have the whole project saved as MIDI (with instruments assigned from the General MIDI bank of my soundblaster) then I plug in Gigastudio with Rewire and just work the samples?

That way I would have the music all notated, all instruments down, and just then instead of using General MIDI using Gigastudio's samples...

what to do what to do... *swings from evil MIDI cables*

Title: Gigastudio 3 latency question
Post by: Anonymous on August 20, 2005, 12:11:44 AM
Ferdie, are you using the right drivers? ASIO drivers wont work as well. Make sure you're using the WDM set...

ReWire always crashes my 3.0ghz hyperthreaded Sony Vaio.

It really isn't efficient on the same computer. Works better going Mac-PC.


Title: Hey Adam!
Post by: SnakeEyes on August 20, 2005, 02:06:40 PM
Hi, thanks for replying.

I think GS3 is not compatible with hyperthreading... you need to go to your BIOS and turn off hyperthreading (although it seems they will soon release a patch to enable it to work with hyperthreading).

Hummm.. I am not sure how to verify which drivers I am using and how to change them.

Aww... does that mean I should get a Mac too now? hehehe... I am too poor now can't buy anything else.

Could I just notate the whole music in MIDI and then use the samples to record it as audio?

Thanks bro,

Title: Gigastudio 3 latency question
Post by: NightShader on August 20, 2005, 04:48:39 PM
Lol, your problem isn't drivers nor hyperthreading my friend. It's ReWiring.

If your soundcard supports GSIF driver, you should stack up Sonar on GigaStudio, and not use ReWire.

How to stack Sonar on GigaStudio:
Start GigaStudio, and start Sonar with the "Start sequencer" button in GigaStudio.

More info about this can be found at: I believe. :)

Title: Hello Nightshader
Post by: SnakeEyes on August 20, 2005, 05:08:06 PM
Hello Nightshader, thanks for the advice.

See, what happens is that I didn't have a GSIF compatible sound card. So I got Sonar 4 so I could use rewire... so you are saying I should just install my Maya sound card (that is GSIF compatible) and get rid of my sound blaster?

That sounds good. I will try it like that. Its just that my soundblaster makes it easier for me to input audio (it has a nice rack I can leave over my computer desk) and this new sound card (Maya) makes me go behind the computer to plug in my audio cables...

I will make sure to go to tascam's website and "absorb" all information they have there...

But I found this info as well (When going to GS3 System Settings menu):
Plugin Latency:
Through GSIF Hardware: 11msec / 512 samples
Through Rewire Application: 46msec / 2048 samples

It doesn't sound that bad... its just half a second... where with GSIF is 1/10th of a second...

Oh well, I will get a sound card... Adam told me not to get Layla ( I have this Maya one I got for 29 bucks )... this will probably do for now.

Thanks all for your expertise!

Title: Gigastudio 3 latency question
Post by: Anonymous on August 21, 2005, 09:35:45 PM
ReWire should work fine with Giga/Sonar.

The latency issues that are inherant with ASIO drivers on some systems are unavoidable.

Oh, and GS3 works fine with Hyperthreading when you update. Yes, you have to turn off hyperthreading to install GS3, but you can turn it on again after the update.

If none of this works, I suggest you try flipping the drivers. On every system I've used Giga and Sonar on (and I'm on my fourth), the ASIO are unpredictable at times.

Again, ReWire shouldn't give you any problems when you figure out how to work it right. I've used it a few times, but I like dumping in things via analog cables, to process through my mixer's soundboard.

this is the site that talks about Giga/Sonar ReWire compatibility.

this one will show you HOW to configure Sonar and Giga correctly.

Either your computer is slow, or the drivers aren't configured correctly.

Title: Gigastudio 3 latency question
Post by: Anonymous on August 21, 2005, 09:37:05 PM
Oh, and btw, don't use Giga to 'render' pre-notated MIDI files. It is meant to be used as a performance device, and it's tough to get your performances to sound good unless you draw in all the midi volumes and articulations. It's a waste if you don't play at least SOME things in. Good luck!  8)

Title: Thanks
Post by: SnakeEyes on August 21, 2005, 10:52:34 PM
Thanks Adam (*is reading the PDF right now*)

Yeah... I noticed that when I play if I press the keys "harder" the velocity automatically adjusts to a higher setting in the MIDI controls... Pretty neat!

As soon as I fix this latency issue (or put in the Maya soundcard) I will start playing the performances in... or I could become an expert in MIDI and set everything in myself  :D

Anyways, I am very happy with GS3.... it really improves the sound a lot. I wonder when they will release a GS4 that improves the composer  :oops:

Thanks again!!!

Title: Gigastudio 3 latency question
Post by: Anonymous on August 22, 2005, 09:06:11 AM
LMAO!  :lol:

That'd be interesting, no?

YES, there are velocity and articulation switches embedded in each sample. Many times, velocity will effect not only the current sample, but actually trigger a WHOLE new sample! I believe the GSPiano II has, like, 16 samples per note or something rediculous like that. AND, there are a different set for the sustain pedal. When you play the foot pedal, you hear the ACUTAL piano pedal lift and drop! HOW KICK ASS IS THAT?!?!?!  :twisted:

Title: foot pedal!
Post by: SnakeEyes on August 22, 2005, 09:12:14 PM
Wow really? You can hear the footpedal do that? How do I do that... when I press my foot pedal on my Kurzweil will it do that? (*I should be trying it hehehe*)

I will definetely try it later... I hope I can hear that too! Now you got me all curious!   :?

I love GS3... I can't believe I didn't have it before... and I didn't even know how to use it, nor do I have any cool samples...

By the way, (and I am not talking about piracy) but on the fatman book by George Sanker and the ultimate guide for computer game audio by Aaron Banks, they say that there are places with free samples for GS we can download... I was just wondering if maybe you guys know about some good shareware/freeware site with samples? (*just so I don't have to keep looking for them*).

What I really wanted is samples of a Brazilian musical instrument called "Berimbau"... It looks like a bow, you play hitting the string with a stick and there's a coconut at the end of the bow that does the acoustic amplification/reverb/timber whatever is called for the instrument... you probably heard it in capoeira music (the brazilian martial art/dance)... I was hoping to add that sound to some of my compositions but oh well, if there are no samples with that I will just buy the instrument and do it myself... maybe I will make samples and give it for free for you guys what you think?  :idea:

Cool!  8)